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    Steve Jobs - The Lost Interview (11 May 2012) [VO] [ST-FR] [Ultra HD 4K]

    Dec 5, 2025

    18982 symbols

    12 min read

    SUMMARY

    In a rediscovered 1995 interview by Robert X. Cringely, Steve Jobs recounts his early fascination with computers, founding Apple with Steve Wozniak, innovations like the Macintosh, conflicts leading to his departure, and visions for software and the web's transformative role.

    STATEMENTS

    • Steve Jobs first encountered a computer at age 10 or 11 through a time-sharing terminal at NASA Ames Research Center, sparking his lifelong passion.
    • At 12, Jobs cold-called Bill Hewlett of Hewlett-Packard for parts, leading to a summer job that shaped his view of a company valuing employees.
    • Jobs attended Hewlett-Packard's Palo Alto research labs, where he discovered the HP 9100, the first desktop computer, fueling his programming enthusiasm.
    • Jobs met Steve Wozniak at 14 or 15, bonding over electronics and collaborating on projects like the blue box for free phone calls.
    • Inspired by an Esquire article on Captain Crunch, Jobs and Wozniak built a digital blue box using tones to hack the AT&T network.
    • The blue box taught Jobs and Wozniak they could control vast infrastructure with simple devices, a lesson pivotal to creating Apple.
    • Necessity drove their first project: building a terminal to access free time-sharing computers, which evolved into the Apple I.
    • The Apple I was hand-built from scavenged parts, initially for personal use, but friends' demand led to selling printed circuit boards.
    • Selling their Volkswagen bus and calculator funded the Apple I's production; a chance visit to the Byte Shop secured the first order of 50 units.
    • Mike Markkula joined as a key partner, investing money and expertise to professionalize Apple and launch the Apple II.
    • The Apple II succeeded by targeting software hobbyists with a packaged plastic computer, announced at the West Coast Computer Faire.
    • Jobs learned business by questioning "why" practices exist, rejecting folklore like standard costing for real-time cost tracking.
    • Programming teaches structured thinking, akin to law school, and should be a required liberal art for everyone.
    • Wealth from Apple's IPO at age 23-25 was secondary to building innovative products and enabling people through technology.
    • Xerox PARC's graphical user interface in 1979 convinced Jobs all future computers would use it, despite its flaws.
    • Xerox failed to commercialize innovations due to sales-focused leadership eroding product sensibility, calling executives "toner heads."
    • IBM's entry scared Apple, but their ecosystem of partners improved their initially poor PC, unlike Apple's isolation.
    • Apple's HP-recruited engineers resisted GUI innovations, forcing Jobs to outsource mouse design for $15 cost in 90 days.
    • Process obsession confuses companies; great products stem from content experts, not management rituals, as seen in IBM's downfall.
    • The Lisa project mismatched Apple's affordable image, leading to its failure and Jobs' ousting from leadership.
    • Macintosh reinvention involved automating factories, negotiating chip prices, and creating a $1,000 computer with new distribution.
    • Motivating the Mac team required recognizing craftsmanship's role in evolving ideas amid trade-offs and daily discoveries.
    • Like polishing rocks in a tumbler, team friction among A-players refines ideas into beautiful products.
    • Dynamic range in software/hardware talent is 50-100:1, so seek A-players who self-select and elevate teams.
    • Direct feedback on subpar work focuses on the output, not ability, fostering improvement without ego-stroking.
    • Apple pioneered desktop publishing with the LaserWriter, partnering with Adobe after canceling internal projects.
    • Jobs' 1985 departure from Apple stemmed from recession leadership vacuum and Sculley's survival instincts scapegoating him.
    • Apple's 1995 state showed eroded leads due to stagnant R&D and lost differentiation against Microsoft.
    • Microsoft succeeded via opportunism and persistence but lacks taste, producing pedestrian products without cultural depth.
    • NeXT focuses on object-oriented software, enabling 10x faster development as a potent business tool.
    • The web fulfills computers as communication devices, democratizing commerce and innovation beyond Microsoft's control.

    IDEAS

    • Early computer access via teletype terminals thrilled kids by executing programs, turning abstract ideas into tangible results.
    • Cold-calling industry leaders as a child built confidence and opened doors to mentorship and jobs.
    • Hacking phone networks with blue boxes revealed how simple inventions can command billion-dollar systems.
    • Building devices from scavenged parts democratizes innovation, bypassing corporate barriers for hobbyists.
    • Printed circuit boards slashed assembly time from 80 hours to hours, enabling scalable personal production.
    • Venture capital often overlooks visionaries; personal rapport, like with Markkula, turns skeptics into partners.
    • Graphical interfaces were inevitable after Xerox demo, blending art-like intuition with technology.
    • Monopolies breed sales over product focus, rotting innovation from within like Xerox's "toner heads."
    • Outsourcing radical ideas, like cheap mice, overcomes internal resistance faster than consensus-building.
    • Institutionalizing early success processes stifles creativity, prioritizing rituals over substance.
    • Elite teams of A-players self-perpetuate, rejecting mediocrity and amplifying collective genius.
    • Feedback as "not good enough" targets work specifics, building resilience in high-stakes environments.
    • Canceling internal projects for superior external talent accelerates breakthroughs in printing tech.
    • Leadership vacuums during crises amplify scapegoating, destroying visionary execution.
    • Stagnant R&D squanders leads, as Apple's post-Jobs era proved against agile rivals.
    • Opportunism plus persistence turns licensing deals into market dominance, per Microsoft's arc.
    • Object-oriented programming revolutionizes software creation, mirroring user-friendly hardware shifts.
    • Web as ultimate direct channel levels playing fields, making small firms appear gigantic.
    • Bicycles amplify human efficiency beyond natural limits, paralleling computers as mind extenders.
    • Stealing great ideas shamelessly, like Picasso, infuses tech with liberal arts richness.
    • Hippie ethos seeks life's deeper sparks, channeling rebellion into products with soul.
    • Computers transmit unspoken feelings, attracting artists over pure technicians.
    • Dynamic talent ranges in tech dwarf other fields, rewarding pursuit of excellence exponentially.
    • Team friction polishes raw ideas like rocks, yielding refined innovations through conflict.
    • Taste guides direction: exposure to human bests ensures tools elevate society subtly.
    • Recession pressures expose survival instincts, fracturing alliances in growing firms.

    INSIGHTS

    • Questioning business folklore uncovers inefficiencies, enabling real-time adaptations over outdated guesses.
    • Hacking vast systems with simple tools empowers individuals, birthing companies like Apple from audacity.
    • Packaged accessibility for non-hobbyists unlocks mass adoption, scaling hardware revolutions.
    • Monopolistic complacency elevates sales over craftsmanship, dooming innovators to irrelevance.
    • Content mastery trumps process; visionary pains drive superior products amid scaling confusion.
    • Elite teams thrive on mutual elevation, where A-players curate environments rejecting averages.
    • Direct, work-focused critique hones excellence without eroding talent confidence.
    • Visionary departures often stem from execution clashes, not idea disputes, in leadership voids.
    • Persistent opportunism exploits ecosystem boosts, turning gambles into dominions.
    • Software's potency lies in enabling services, outpacing hardware in competitive edges.
    • Web democratizes communication, fulfilling computers' social potential beyond computation.
    • Tools like computers amplify innate abilities, ranking as humanity's pinnacle invention.
    • Liberal arts infusion via diverse talents breathes spirit into tech, avoiding narrow sterility.
    • Feedback's clarity separates ability from output, fostering growth in intense pursuits.
    • Crises reveal true instincts, where survival trumps unity, fracturing foundational bonds.

    QUOTES

    • "Nobody knows why they do what they do nobody thinks about things very deeply in business that's what I found."
    • "I view computer science as a liberal art it should be something that everybody learn."
    • "The most important thing was the company the people the products we were making what we were going to enable people to do with these products."
    • "It was obvious you couldn't argue about the inevitability of it."
    • "They just had no clue about what they were seeing."
    • "Great products stem from content experts, not management rituals."
    • "Designing a product is keeping 5,000 things in your brain and fitting them all together."
    • "Through that group of incredibly talented people bumping up against each other having arguments having fights sometimes making some noise and working together they polish each other and they polish the ideas."
    • "When you get enough A players together they really like working with each other because they've never had a chance to do that before."
    • "Their products have no spirit to them their products have no sort of spirit of Enlightenment about them."
    • "The personal computer was the bicycle of the mind."
    • "Good artists copy great artists steal."
    • "There's something more going on there's another side of the coin that we don't talk about much."
    • "Computers are the medium that is best capable of transmitting some feeling that you want to share with other people."

    HABITS

    • Cold-call experts for advice and parts, turning curiosity into opportunities.
    • Attend research labs weekly to explore cutting-edge prototypes hands-on.
    • Collaborate on bold projects with skilled peers to accelerate learning.
    • Scavenge and build from available resources to prototype without budgets.
    • Question every business practice deeply to eliminate unnecessary folklore.
    • Expose yourself to diverse fields like art and history for innovative cross-pollination.
    • Hire and surround with A-players who self-select for excellence.
    • Provide direct, specific feedback on work to refine outputs swiftly.
    • Visit global factories to benchmark and automate production processes.
    • Steal and adapt great ideas shamelessly to infuse products with broader culture.
    • Prioritize product content over management processes in team decisions.
    • Reflect on personal experiences, like early hacks, to draw life lessons.
    • Seek liberal arts education alongside technical skills for holistic thinking.

    FACTS

    • In 1971, unlisted phone numbers didn't exist, enabling a 12-year-old Jobs to reach Bill Hewlett directly.
    • The HP 9100, suitcase-sized with CRT display, was the first self-contained desktop computer in 1968.
    • Blue boxes exploited AT&T's flawed signaling in voice bands, allowing handset control of the network.
    • Apple I boards sold for cost to friends, but Byte Shop ordered 50 fully assembled for $500 each.
    • Xerox PARC demoed GUI in 1979, but commercial failure let Apple adapt it for Macintosh.
    • Macintosh mouse prototyped in 90 days for $15, versus engineers' 5-year $300 estimate.
    • Apple became world's largest printer revenue company by 1985 via LaserWriter.
    • Jobs worth $100 million at 25 from 1980 IPO, yet never sold stock initially.
    • Object-oriented tech at NeXT enabled 10x faster software building than traditional methods.
    • Web projected to shift 15% of US catalog sales, worth tens of billions, to online by 2005.
    • Human biking efficiency tops condor's natural locomotion per Scientific American study.
    • Macintosh applications dominated by Microsoft post-1984, springboarding to PC market.
    • Apple's 1995 market share eroded as installed base shrank without growth.

    REFERENCES

    • Triumph of the Nerds TV series by Robert X. Cringely.
    • Esquire magazine article on Captain Crunch.
    • AT&T Technical Journal from Stanford Linear Accelerator library.
    • HP 9100 desktop computer.
    • Blue box device with logo "He's Got The Whole World in His Hands."
    • Apple I and Apple II computers.
    • West Coast Computer Faire event.
    • Xerox PARC's Alto computer network and GUI demo.
    • Lisa computer project.
    • Macintosh automated factory in California.
    • LaserWriter printer with Adobe PostScript.
    • NeXT object-oriented software platform.
    • Friends and Family MCI billing software.
    • Scientific American article on locomotion efficiency.
    • Picasso's saying on copying versus stealing ideas.

    HOW TO APPLY

    • Start with personal necessity: Identify unmet needs like affordable terminals and build prototypes from scavenged parts.
    • Partner early: Seek mentors and co-founders like Wozniak by bonding over shared passions in electronics.
    • Fund bootstraps: Sell personal assets to cover initial production costs, like buses for circuit boards.
    • Pitch boldly: Approach stores with assembled products, negotiating credit terms with distributors on net 30.
    • Recruit vision-aligned investors: Convince experts like Markkula to join as partners, not just funders.
    • Design for masses: Package hardware accessibly in plastic for non-hobbyists, focusing on software ease.
    • Challenge norms: Question accounting folklore, implementing real-time tracking in automated systems.
    • Visit innovators: Tour labs like Xerox PARC to steal and refine germinal ideas for your products.
    • Assemble elite teams: Prioritize A-players who thrive on friction, polishing ideas through debate.
    • Outsource resistance: Bypass internal skeptics by external prototyping, like cheap mice from designers.
    • Iterate relentlessly: Evolve ideas via daily trade-off balancing, keeping 5,000 concepts in mind.
    • Feedback directly: Critique work specifics to realign without doubting abilities, driving excellence.

    ONE-SENTENCE TAKEAWAY

    Steve Jobs' journey reveals that blending audacious innovation, elite teams, and humanistic taste propels technology to amplify human potential profoundly.

    RECOMMENDATIONS

    • Learn programming early as a liberal art to sharpen structured thinking across disciplines.
    • Build simple devices to hack systems, gaining confidence in controlling larger infrastructures.
    • Question every business practice to dismantle folklore and foster genuine efficiency.
    • Surround yourself with A-players who self-perpetuate excellence in collaborative environments.
    • Expose innovations to diverse influences like art and poetry for products with soul.
    • Visit pioneering labs to absorb and adapt revolutionary concepts swiftly.
    • Provide clear, work-focused feedback to refine outputs without ego barriers.
    • Bootstrap with personal sacrifices to launch scalable hardware without venture dependency.
    • Automate production after global benchmarking to slash costs and enable affordability.
    • Partner with external talents over internal projects for faster breakthroughs.
    • Steal great ideas shamelessly, infusing tech with cultural depth.
    • Prioritize content mastery over processes to avoid institutional stagnation.
    • Nudge technology's vector early toward communication over mere computation.
    • Channel hippie-like curiosity into products that transmit deeper human feelings.
    • Persist opportunistically, turning ecosystem alliances into market dominions.

    MEMO

    In the dim glow of a 1995 interview rediscovered from a garage, Steve Jobs, then exiled from the empire he built, unfolds his origin story with the candor of a man who has stared into the silicon abyss. At 10, a teletype terminal at NASA Ames ignited his wonder, transforming abstract code into executed dreams. This thrill propelled a 12-year-old to cold-call Hewlett-Packard's Bill Hewlett, securing parts and a summer job that etched ideals of employee-centric companies into his worldview. By his teens, Jobs bonded with Steve Wozniak over electronics wizardry, their audacious blue box—a tone-generating hack of AT&T's network—teaching them that two kids could command billions in infrastructure. "We could build a little thing that could control a giant thing," Jobs recalls, a revelation birthing Apple from garage tinkering.

    Necessity birthed the Apple I: a terminal to tap free computing time, fused with a microprocessor for personal use. Scavenged parts and sold heirlooms funded printed circuit boards, and a fateful pitch to the Byte Shop in Mountain View sealed their first 50-unit order. Mike Markkula's entry professionalized the venture, repackaging the Apple II in sleek plastic for software hobbyists, unveiled triumphantly at the West Coast Computer Faire. Jobs, ever the skeptic of business orthodoxy, learned by probing "why"—ditching archaic costing for precise tracking in Macintosh's automated factories. Wealth from the 1980 IPO, cresting at $100 million by 25, paled against the mission: enabling human potential through tools. Yet, Xerox PARC's 1979 graphical interface demo blinded him to networked futures, convincing him all computers would intuit like art.

    Innovation's flame flickered amid internal strife. HP transplants balked at mice and fonts, forcing Jobs to outsource a $15 wonder in 90 days. Process fetishism, he warns, confuses ritual for essence, mirroring IBM's malaise and Apple's drift toward the mismatched Lisa. Ousted in a recession-fueled coup by CEO John Sculley—whom Jobs ruefully calls his worst hire—the visionary brooded, then rallied a "mission from God" team for Macintosh. This band of A-players, musicians and zoologists moonlighting as coders, polished raw ideas through friction, like rocks in a tumbler yielding gems. Dynamic talent ranges in tech—50-to-1—demanded no B-listers; direct critiques honed work without coddling egos. The Mac's 1984 launch reinvented distribution and manufacturing, but Sculley's "disease" of idea-over-execution eroded Apple's 10-year lead.

    By 1995, Apple teetered on a "glide slope to die," its differentiation cloned by Microsoft's opportunistic churn—pedestrian products sans taste or spirit. Jobs, at NeXT, championed object-oriented software for 10x faster creation, a weapon in business wars like MCI's billing blitz. The web, he prophesies, fulfills computers as communication bicycles for the mind, democratizing commerce and innovation beyond monopolies. Humans, tool-builders supreme, amplify via inventions ranking computers atop history's pantheon. Taste, drawn from Picasso's thefts and liberal arts, nudges this vector toward enlightenment.

    Jobs embodies the hippie-nerd hybrid: seeking life's ineffable sparks to infuse products with loveable soul. "Computers transmit feelings you want to share," he muses, attracting poets to pixels. His tale cautions against survival instincts fracturing visions, yet inspires nudging trajectories early for profound impact. In Silicon Valley's crucible, Jobs' lost words remind: true progress polishes humanity through passionate friction.